The Importance of Bath Ventilation – a Lesson Re-Learned in my Primary Bath
*******
A few years back we did our primary bath. Well, to be more accurate – we put a quote, unquote primary bath into what was once an 8×8 closet. After a lot of consideration, we decided not to reconfigure the room, I mean – move walls or change the door’s location. We just put it in.
We decided to hire this job out to my wife’s Other Man, you know – the “Other Man” … Mr. Pete, we’ll call him. He works with my wife as her partner on her flip projects. (Note: Number 3 is under way, but is moving slowly – thanks in part to an extremely uncooperative Winter.) Here’s a look at their last >> Mrs. Moxie Flips Out 2.
Not going too much more into it, I knew at the time of one area where we (*cough* the Other Man) skimped. For the connection on, the venting for, the new bath fan, he used flex duct, and dropped it into a corner of our attic. There it funneled into a strange apparatus that he … engineered.
Now, I knew, you should almost under no circumstance ever vent into an attic (not even into a vented soffit – like some builders are prone to do). I knew this … yet I did defer (for a couple reasons) to my wife’s partner; I let him have his way.
“So … What happened?”
Well, within a matter of months, we began to notice the formation of small spots on the bathroom ceiling. Yep, Mold!
While this was quickly wiped clean, I also made a quick visit to the attic, where I noticed that the … apparatus had come disconnected from the bath fan housing. (Essentially the bath fan blew it right off.) At the time, I remember thinking – “I have got to address that bath fan venting, and get it vented properly, to the outside.”
That was probably somewhere around, January 2012. Ha!
And well, another year … and a half passed and in that time the mold spots returned and left, and then returned, this time – a little more pronounced. Areas of the ceiling too showed signs of puckering and the paint even began to flake and peel in some spots. Whoa! I can remember at the time saying, “Yes, I know Dear. I’m getting to it.”
Installing Bath Fan Venting in a Finished Attic Space
I hope through my story I impress upon you the importance of proper bath ventilation. And yes, sure, your bath venting set-up can break down at many places. Mine – sure, insufficient venting, which was dumping moist air into an under-insulated attic above a ceiling constructed of plaster and lath.
Now, I know those may not have been the only factors coming into play here. The bath door, for example – did the installer (me) ensure that a minimum ¾ inch clearance was left to allow for the proper amount of make-up air? Yeah, you know – an old house and the floor at the door is slightly slanted, so just to be sure – I took another 3/8” off of it before I even started the work.
Ensure a 3/4″ space for bath fan make up air
And anyway … I took a Sunday afternoon, and as our attic is a finish…able space, I hard-piped using 4” rigid duct, going out the attic’s side wall. It wasn’t a super-amazing or difficult project, considering of course that the bath fan had already been installed. But imagine it – a one man show up into the 3rd-floor attic, down to the ground and then up a 32’ ladder. Down the 32’ foot ladder and repeat until it is hooked up. A five-foot run of duct took roughly four hours (ugh!) and I see why now that the Other Man wanted to avoid it.
Other measures taken: Prior to touch up the service with some drywall compound, I used an over-the-counter moldicide (maybe I can call it that) to more permanently treat the ceiling, I primed with KILZ 2 and I painted using a Behr Kitchen and Bath paint. This Sateen finish – hopefully offering a more moisture-resistant sheen. (Like the Other Man who painted with a Flat … I simply grabbed what I had lying around.) I added a Mildewcide Paint Additive before rolling it on.
And one final note: When choosing our bath fan, I selected a NuTone – Model 684NT. It’s very much a budget model, sold exclusively at the Home Depot. Rated at 80cfm and up to 75sf, I figured it was enough to service this just smaller than 8×8, less than 64sf, space. (I chose the same model for our 5 x 12 hall bath, and installed it independent of this renovation (with proper venting) several years earlier.)
If the mold and paint flaking in the end does not subside, I plan to upgrade this fan – a process which will unfortunately require an entirely new housing i.e. I can’t just slip in a new, beefier fan motor. Also, as I seem to constantly remind everyone in my household, there is one very important thing when it comes to bath ventilation – you have to, regardless of the sizing of your bath fan, actually run it when you shower. Thank you.
*******
Disclaimer: This post was sponsored by no one, other than myself. While I am again humbled by a house, I share it to show what could happen if you don’t do things right the first time. I know too that I need work on not only my attic insulation (possibly insulating my new duct also), the paint in my gables, as well as also, Yes I know – I still need to stain my bathroom door. I swear I’m getting to it.
For more on Installing a Rigid Bath Fan Duct in 9 Steps (posted by me on the social media site – HomeTalk.com). For more Mold Prevention Tips, please see the article – Building for the Fungus Among Us. :~)
For more on selecting a Bath Fan and how to vent it, here’s an article from HGTV – Choosing a Bath Ventilation Fan. ~ jb
*******
*******
Hey Dog! In Minnesota and highly recommended everywhere is to include wrapping the ductwork in insulation. This is a pain to do, trust me.
Benefits are moisture does not form ice on the metal in winter which melts and goes you know where.
Insulating ductwork is even done in conditioned spaces.
Of course you live in the Baltimore area where the hot winds of Capital Hill congressional speakers may eliminate the worst of winter chills. Keeps birds from roosting on telephone poles kites flying forever at the very least.
ha! good to see you (The) Paul and good to see that you haven’t changed a bit.
Still – you make an excellent point. While I considered wrapping this pipe I figured it might be overkill. I’ve had the install in now for about a month and half and haven’t really had any issues. (We’ve had some pretty chilly weather out here in that time.) If anything, my issues I think maybe arise from my fan being a little under-sized and my family members not leaving it run long enough.
Hope you are staying busy my friend and I hope you are well. ~jb
Nice to see you too!
Wrapping the pipe in my area makes the installation code compliant, so no wrap no permit finaled.
On bath fans like other things the more money you spend the better the product and properly sizing a fan is more important that some people might think. Panasonic fans are at the top of my list for being so quiet, efficient and dependable but other brands perform well also.
Like you I have a Honey Do list that never seems to get shorter and after 20 years of being married to Blondy I accept the fact she sticks with me not because I look exactly like George Clooney but because there is a certain cachet to having a partner who tackles home repair with the confidence of a terrier. I won her over on our first date when afterwards she invited me into her place for a cup of coffee and coyly mentioned how she had bought a picture at a yard sale and was wondering if I could hang it for her without ruining the plaster in her 100 year old home.
The rest as they say is history.
great story Paul. and like you, while I can do almost everything around the house, I often find (at least in this stage of life) I just can’t get to things as quickly as she’d like. The Other Man just takes some of the pressure off of me – so I’m okay with it. (Mrs. Moxie btw can certainly hold her own on some things and especially on painting – possibly one reason why I stick with her.)
I have never used a Panasonic (though I have heard good things and I think we have even covered them in here). It’s usually NuTone or Broan for me (same company) as they are the most readily available. There is nothing that I see in the specs on this fan that says that it shouldn’t be working for me. But as I said I plan to continue to monitor it.
Thanks for sharing your experience and expertise Paul. Be well. ~jb
Wow! SO GOOD TO KNOW! I love when people like you write about this stuff. It makes things easier for people like me, who are sure to goole what we don’t know and will benefit from your experience. You did a fantastic job. Thanks for the share!
thank you Michele, good to see you stop by. As a guy who has worked professionally fixing other peoples baths … I had never seen this one. (In a way, I couldn’t believe it happened in *my* house. ha!) As I said, there may be many factors coming into play, and really it is a little to early to ensure that all my problems are licked. Still I hope it helps someone if they are ever looking to troubleshoot. cheers.